Let’s focus on an issue that became an issue after some comments made by Senator Mike Lee Thursday in front of the Senate Judiciary Committee. President Barrack Obama responding in his weekly address, not by name, but speaking of Senator Lee.
“One Senator gumming up the whole works for the entire country is certainly not what our Founding Fathers envisioned. The truth is, neither party has been blameless in tactics like these, but it’s time for both parties to put an end to them” (voice clip).
White House Press Secretary, Jay Carney, in the briefing room:
“It is an example of how the system has broken down. That out of pique a single senator can hold up all nominations is highly unfortunate, and that’s why the President mentioned it in his weekly address” (voice clip).
Let’s get more on this issue and get some understanding of what it’s all about. Senator Mike Lee is a Republican from Utah joins us on POTUS Center, Senator, welcome back to POTUS.
“Thank you, it’s good to be with you.”
The idea first of all this is your objection, and by the way not just yours but several other’s objections to the nominations that the President made to fill the position of the National Labor Relations Board. There were three of them and the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau which Cordray he named them they’re not just nominations now, they’re recess appointments while the Senate was not technically in recess and that is the source of the complaint, correct?
“Yes, that’s absolutely right and the reason I have the concerns that I do has a lot to do with the fact that I’ve been meeting with constituents throughout my state and talking to people around the country who were very upset and who feel powerless as a result of the act taken by the President that’s outside of established norms, rules, practices, procedures that have been followed for many decades in connection with recess appointments. They recognize this President has overstepped his bounds. He has exercised power that is not his, it belongs to the people and it is supposed to be exercised through the people’s elected representatives in the Senate and not through the President; he has taken that away from them and they feel powerless. So I sympathize with that and that’s why I made the comments that I have made.”
The objection from the White House has been that this particular appointment is not opposed, that is Richard Cordray, by even Republicans. They all think he is qualified, it’s rather that Republicans are upset that the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau was created in the first place and this is their way of trying to keep it from doing it’s work even though the legislation has passed. How do you respond to that?
“Well, that is the President’s way of saying I don’t like the way the that the Senate is proceeding. I don’t like the delays that have occurred in the Senate and as a result of that I’m just going to thumb my nose at the constitution. The conclusion doesn’t follow from the complaint there on the President’s part. There have for many decades been complaints in the Senate about things not moving according to way the Chief Executive wants and that just doesn’t justify a constitutional violation. It can’t and the minute we allow that constitutional violation then we really are creating a dangerous pattern and a dangerous precedent that we will regret. I want to point out here that this is not a partisan concern at all. I would have exactly the same concern, I would be reacting in exactly the same way if this were a Republican President and if in the future we have a Republican who is unwise enough to pursue this course of action, I will respond in exactly the same way that I am now responding to President Obama.”
Do you feel that recess appointments themselves are outside of what the constitution allows for?
“Oh no, not at all. The constitution clearly does allow for recess appointments, but for the clause to work, it has to be in recess for purposes of Article II Section II of the constitution which contains this authorization.”
Since you brought up the constitution Senator Mike Lee, let’s get your philosophical approach to the advice and consent function of the Senate because the object seems to be more than norm both with Republicans and Democrats depending on who is sitting it the White House as opposed to advice and consent. I know that Senator McCain during the 2008 campaign said that he does believe in somewhat in that, maybe it’s a little out of fashion opinion, that the Senator, the President gets to name who he wants unless there is compelling reason not to have that individual in place. That doesn’t seem to be the rule now. What’s your philosophical approach to that function of the Senate?
“Well first of all, let me push back a little bit on your assumption that doesn’t seem to be the norm. The overwhelming majority of those executive branch officials and judicial branch officials that have been appointed by the President in this Congress and the last one have in fact been confirmed. So it simply isn’t true that it’s more an object function than an advice and consent function, most of them are confirmed. I do agree moreover with the few point that says elections have consequences and when the President of the United States is elected, it becomes the President’s objective to and prerogative to decide whom to nominate. That doesn’t mean that every one of those people is going to be confirmed. In fact, the mere reality that the Senate has this right means that some of them won’t be and so I agree with you that the President is entitled to a lot of deference and I have given the President a lot of deference up to this point in my first year in the Senate. I voted for a lot of people he has nominated to judicial and other positions that I myself would not have nominated but I voted to confirm them because it seems like a reasonable choice but when the President stops respecting the Senate’s authority, that’s when I feel compelled to stand up and say ‘Look, I’m not going to give this man the same level of deference when he is completely thumbing his nose at our constitutional authority.’ That’s power that doesn’t belong to him. That’s power that belongs to the people and it’s supposed to be exercised by those they elected to the Senate.”
From a practical standpoint, how do you proceed other than just raising objections? What can you do?
“Well you know I have yet to announce what the precise course of action I will follow on. I will be making that announcement sometime here soon but the….”
You are welcome to make that announcement this morning if you’d like by the way (laughing).
“I appreciate that, that’s neighborly of you.”
Just offering, you know.
“Ya, ya, no it’s good of you, it’s very good. What I have said so far is just an articulation of my concerns and why I’m doing this. This is not obstructionism, nor is it delay for the sake of delay. What I am doing is expressing concerns that are shared by people throughout my state and across America that has caused them to feel powerless, has caused them to feel like power has been taken away that doesn’t belong to the President and it needs to be called out because this is not just a problem of Republicans versus Democrats. This is a problem of constitutional dimension and that is why I am raising it.”
Senator Mike Lee thank you for joining us in POTUS this morning, we appreciate it.
“Thank you very much.”